Cars That Matter Ep 29 - Jay Beever, Embraer, and Designing Luxury Pt. 1

00:00:03
Speaker 1: From CurtCo  Media.

00:00:06
Robert Ross: Let's  talk  about  designing  luxury.

 

00:00:09
Jay Beever: In  my  opinion,  being  able  to  do  things  that  you  shouldn't  be  able  to  do.  In  an  airplane  at  35,000, 40, 45,000  and  even 51, 000  feet,  you  are  in  an  environment  that  wants  to  kill  you.  If  we  can  protect  from  that  and  still  experience  that  environment,  that's  luxury,  that's  the  secret  sauce.

 

00:00:29
Speaker 4: This  is  Cars  That  Matter.

 

00:00:46
Robert Ross: This  is  Robert  Ross  with  another  episode  of  Cars  that  Matter.  Welcome  to  a  very  special  guest,  Jay  Beever.

 

00:00:52
Jay Beever: Thank  you,  Robert.

 

00:00:53
Robert Ross: It's  great  to  have  you  here.  You  and  I  have  had  so  many  conversations  offline  that  it  occurred  to  me  that  you're  someone  that  our  audience  should  meet.  Jay's  vice  president of  design  operations  at  Embraer  Executive  Jets.  You've  all  heard  of  that  company.  With  that  in  mind,  welcome  to  the  show.

 

00:01:08
Jay Beever: It's  always  a  pleasure.  The  first  time  we  met,  I  reflect  back  on  that  moment  fondly,  when  the  Sky  Yacht  program  was  kicked  off  before  it was Skyacht and  you  had  asked  Eddie, " Can  we  do  the  Ultimate  Gift  for  the  Robb  Report  in  2013?"  And  sure  enough,  we  use  that  Lineage  and  jumped  through  a  whole  bunch  of  hoops  and  made  some  things  happen.  It's  been  fun  ever  since.

 

00:01:25
Robert Ross: Of  course,  Jay's  referring  to  a  previous  guest  we've  had,  Eddie  Sotto  who  is  an  incredible  experiential  designer.  Formerly  one  of  the  Disney  Imagineers  and  creative  director  with  them.  And  has  gone  on  to  develop  any  number  of  fantastic  aviation  interiors,  yacht  interiors,  and  some  projects  that  really  are  out  of  fantasy  land,  which  by  the  way,  Jay,  is  what  you  folks  at  Embraer  do,  you  create  flying  fantasies  for  people.
 We're  going  to  dive  into  something  a  little  different  today.  We're  going  to  talk  about  luxury  at  large  and  how  it  transfers  or  applies  to  automotive  design.  We're  going  to  get  back  to  the  cars  and  your  history  with  them,  Jay.  But  first,  let's  talk  about  designing  luxury.  In  the  luxury  car  world,  you've  got  luxury  four  doors,  you've  got  luxury  SUVs,  you've  got  luxury  sports  cars,  you've  even  got  luxury  hyper  cars.  Every  one  of  them  aspires  to  be  the  best  they  can  be.  Something  like  a  Bugatti  or  a Pagani,  I  mean,  those  are  remarkable  works  of  art.
 When  it  comes  to  luxury  and  private  aviation,  you  guys  have  developed  some  pretty  amazing  concepts.  Obviously  the Skyacht  One  is  the  project  that  you  and  Eddie  Sotto  worked  on  together.  It  was  published  in  Robb  Report  a  number  of  years  ago.  But  you've  gone  all  over  the  map,  everything  from  art  deco,  to  the  wild  West,  Manhattan,  Kyoto,  I  mean  all  over  the  map.  Talk  about  some  of  the  themes  and  some  of  the  technical  challenges  that  you  embraced  and  resolved.  I'm  thinking  about,  your  Japanese- inspired  interior  were  really  remarkable.  Things that had  never  been  done  in  a  private  jet  before.

 

00:02:58
Jay Beever: And  that's  really  luxury.  When  you  can  do  something  that's  new,  that  inspires,  people  appreciate  that.  And  it  has  to  perform.  Something  has  to  perform  better  than  the  others.  And  that's  often  a  luxury  price  tag.  You  can't  put  a  Bugatti  paint  scheme  on  a  Corvette  and  call  it  a  Bugatti.  You  need  a  thousand  horsepower.  You  need  the  grill  to  be  the  way  it  is.  So,  it  has  a  price  tag  for  what  it  can  do.
 To  answer  your  first  question,  what  is  luxury?  It's  different  for  everybody?  Luxury  could  be  good  health,  having  a  family,  wealth,  financial  wealth,  it  could  be  having  something  rare  that  is  not  repeatable.  So,  where  do  you  go  with  it?  We  had  to  look  at  that  because  selling  private  jets  to  people...  These  are  business  tools,  clearly,  most  of  them  are.  And  sometimes  they're  also  very  personal  escape  tools.  But  as  a  business  tool,  which  is  a  majority  of  the  market,  this  is  serving  a  clientele  that  are  changing  the  world  in  commerce  and  finance  and  business  and  industries  making  things  they  need  to  be  in  other  countries.  And  it's  a  time  machine.  So,  that's  a  luxury.  Time  is  a  luxury.

 

00:03:52
Robert Ross: Mm- hmm ( affirmative).  It  is.  It's a  time  machine.  You're  right.

 

00:03:54
Jay Beever: And  we're  dealing  with  a  clientele  that's  global.  Does  everything  have  to  look  Western?  Does  everything  have  to  look  Versace  and  contemporary?  I  realized  early  on  that  we  need  to  come  up  with  a  variety  of  themes  and  concepts,  stuff  that  I  can  not  get  accomplished  a  hundred  percent  internally  because  we  had  a  new  Phenom  to  design.  We  had  the  Legacy  interior  to  redesign,  which  was  already  brand  new.  The  aircraft  is  18  months  from  delivery  and  we're  redesigning  the  whole  interior  because  the  finish  was  wrong  and  all  these  other  problems.

 

00:04:22
Robert Ross: Just  to  enlighten  our  listeners,  you've  got  a  portfolio  of  eight  private  business  jets.  Is  that  right?  That's  a  lot  of  airplanes.

 

00:04:27
Jay Beever: Seven,  to  be  exact.  And  now  we're  down  to  four,  the  Phenom  100  through Praetor  600.  The  Legacy  650  and  Legacy  600  were  phased  out  because  those  are  older  platforms  based  off  the  commercial  jet.  And  the  Lineage  was  also  phased  out  last  year.  And  that  was  my  queen  of  the  sky,  so  to  speak,  because  it  was  the  one  that  allowed  full  customization,  STC  interiors,  which  is  a  supplemental  type  certificate  that  allows  you  to... It's  a  license  to  kill  in  design.

 

00:04:53
Robert Ross: You  can  put  a  pool  table  in the middle of your  airplane,  practically.

 

00:04:56
Jay Beever: Exactly.  So,  we  had  all  that.  And  then  when  I  joined  in  2012,  that's  what  I  was  looking  at.  But  internally,  we  had  a  mission  to  create  the  DNA.  What  is  the  DNA  of  Embraer  Executive  Jets?  So,  whether  they  get  into  a  Phenom  or  they  get  it  up  into  a  Lineage,  the  execution,  the  smell,  all  of  it  says,  that's  an  Embraer.  So,  we're  coming  up  with  that  whole  plan  internally.  But  at  the  same  time,  I  watched  this  queen  of  the  skies  for  Embraer  called  the  Lineage,  five  cabin  zones,  almost  900  square  feet  of  living  space  and  nobody  knows  it  can  be  purchased  naked,  without  interior.  So,  here  we  have  this  STC- capable  aircraft  that  should  be  getting  tons  of  attention  that  nobody  really  knows  about.

 

 Eddie  called  me  up  and  said, " Hey  Jay.  Remember  our  previous  conversations  about  doing  something  special  on  airplanes?"  I'm  like, " Yes,  sir."  He  goes, " Well,  my  good  friend,  Robert  Ross,  called  me  up  and  they're  doing  something  with  Robb  Report  called  the  Ultimate  Gift  for  2013,  published  in  December.  They  would  like  it  to  be  a  Lineage.  And  I  guess,  Robb  Report  really  likes  you  guys  and  they  think  a  Lineage  would  be  a  cool  opportunity.  And  they'd  like  to  see  what  I  can  do  with  it.  You  want to do it?"

 

00:06:01
Robert Ross: You  can't  say  no  to  Eddie,  man.  He's  the  best  sales  guy  in  the world and the  most  creative.

 

00:06:06
Jay Beever: Yeah, he's an experiential designer, but  he's also  an  experiential  salesman.  It  was  such  a  fun  time.  What  was  nice  was,  internally  while  we  could  focus  on  the  nuts  and  bolts  and  the  details  of  making  the  Swiss  watch  called  the  new  Executive  Jet  interior  for  Embraer,  Eddie  on  the  outside,  could  focus  on  the  dream  and  building  this  concept,  that  we  would  keep  in  an  incubator,  quiet.  Nobody  really  knew  about  it.  But  when  it  was  presented,  it  was  done,  it  was  finished.  We  had  renderings  of  it.  We  spent  eight  weeks,  only  two  months  sketching.

 

 Eddie  sketched  out  the  theme  of  the  ideas.  And  he  said, " Jay,  imagine  walking  in  this  airplane  and  it  smells  like  pipe  tobacco,  and  it  looks  like  it  should  have  come  out  of  a  sailing  yacht  from  the  thirties." " Oh,  that's  cool."  He  goes, " Yeah.  You  know  George  Whittell  Jr?"  And  I  said, " No,  I  don't  know  George  Whittell  Jr."  He  goes, " Yeah.  You  know  the  Thunderbird  yacht  in  Lake  Tahoe?" " Oh  yeah.  The  Thunderbird, yeah."  He  goes, " Yeah,  George  Whittell  Jr.  He  commissioned  that  boat  to  be  built  because  of  his  DC- 2  all  aluminum  airplane.  Loved  that  superstructure  look  and  he  wanted  that  wood  mahogany  Hacker  craft  from  Michigan  look.  Let's  put  the  two  together."  So,  they  got  a  stainless  steel  superstructure  on  a  mahogany  lower.  And  it's  the  most  famous  antique  boat  in  the  world.

 

00:07:08
Robert Ross: That  is  a  remarkable  boat.  It  blew  my  mind  when  I  first  saw  that  thing.  I  couldn't  believe  that  somebody  had  actually  imagined,  much  less  built  it.

 

00:07:17
Jay Beever: Imagine  because  they  believed  in  the  crossover  opportunities  of  different  industries.  So,  we  took  this  modern  marvel  fly- by- wire,  self- landing,  six  foot  four  quarterback  that  does  a 4- 4- 40  called  the  Lineage.  It  lands  in  Aspen,  lands  in  Teterboro,  New  Jersey,  lands  London  City,  and  (inaudible)   airports  are  only  meant  for  small  airplanes,  is  this  big  Lineage.  So,  what  can  we  take  and  do  to  this?  Let's  reverse  the  equation.  Let's  inspire  the  airplane  like  that  boat  was  inspired.  So,  that  became  our  theme.  And  Eddie,  he  penned  it.  We got  the  rendering  teams  to  model  it  all  out.  So,  on  the  Embraer  side,  we  took  care  of  the  modeling  and  rendering  and  got  it  to  be  what  it  was.  And  lo  and  behold,  we  had  the Skyacht  One.
 And  I  pitched  it  to  my  colleagues  at  one  of  our  events  and  said, " Guys,  it's  October.  We  need  to  go  to  print  in  a  few  weeks  on  this." " But  that's  not  part  of  our  strategic  plan,  Jay."  I  said, " No,  but  this  is  an  idea  that  will  help  get  tons  of  attention  and  earned  media.  We  won't  have  to  pay  to  publish  it  because  people  are  going  to  want  to  know  more  about  it  because  it's  cool  and  it's  different,  it  has  a  story.  And  Eddie  helped  us  with  it."  A  long  debate  ensued  because  we  were  a  company  embedded  in  the  hierarchy  of  design  and  engineering  and  execution, there is a  time  to  release  things.  We  don't  mess  around.  We  need  to  be  able  to  make  it.  I  said, " Well,  we  can  make  this  because  everything  was  sketched  and  designed.  Right  over  the  monuments  of  the  aircraft  that  we  have  today,  it's  all  materials.  There's  no  re- engineering  of  substrates  and  connections  to  the  fuselage  or  any  of  that."

 

 So,  I  talked  them  into  it and  they  said, " Well,  what  are  we going  to  charge  for it?  Because  if  somebody  wants  it,  they're  going  to  have  to  buy  it."  I  called  Eddie  and  said, " Eddie,  we  got  the  green  light.  We're  going  to  put  it  out.  We  got  full  support  and  we  should  publish  it.  If  somebody  asks  for $ 70  million."  He  goes, " 70  million,  you  can  get a  G650  for  that.  It's  got  to  be  more."  I  said, " Okay.  How  does  83  million  sound  to  you?"  He  goes, " Great.  Let's  do  it."  So-

 

00:08:55
Robert Ross: There  you go.

 

00:08:56
Jay Beever: We  didn't  know  what  the  price  was  because  it's  a  concept.  But  to  help  understand  what it  would  take  to  execute  the  interior  and  look  at  the  custom  completion  and  luxury  against  that  question,  every  detail...  And  it was going to  be  luxurious  because  it  was  unique.  It  was  something  not  seen  and  truly  not  expected  to  come  out  of  Embraer.  And  that  paid  its  dividends.

 

00:09:15
Robert Ross: And  of  course,  you  didn't  stop  there.  You  conjured  a  wild  West  interior  that  reminded  me  of  something  off  of  Ben  Cartwright's  ranch.  It  was  phenomenal.

 

00:09:24
Jay Beever: At  the  time,  I  remember,  we  were  in  some  sales  campaigns  with  some  individuals  in  Texas. And  Texas  is  big  ranch  country,  right?  J.  R.  Ewing  from  the  Dallas  days.  I'd  been  to  Brazil  quite  a  bit  and  Brazil  is  big  ranch  country,  too.  All  those  things  that kind of relate to  Texas  in  a  lot  of  ways.  Eddie  actually  used  this  word, " What  if  J.  R.  Fracking  needed  an  airplane?"  I'm  like, " Yes,  J.  R.  Fracking  meets  Brazilian  rancher  and  they  create  an  evil  loved  child  called  the  Skyranch  One."  Besides  to  being  beautiful  and  saddlery  work  like  what  Eames  might  do  on  the  chair  and  breakaway  details  and  bison  horn  finishes,  all  this  stuff  that Eddie  had  come  up  with,  I  said, " Eddie,  this  needs  to  be  really,  really  special.  Not that  it's  not  special,  what  you  have  so  far,  but  I've  got  something  we  can  put  in  here."

 

 And  what  had  happened  is  after  the  Skyacht,  we'd  had  a  marketing  relationship  with  Boat  International  and  they  had  put  me  in  contact  with  Patrick  Knowles.  And  he  was  a  super  yacht  designer  in  Fort  Lauderdale.  And  Patrick  and  I  and  the  team  started  talking  about  a  hypothetical  customer  called  Our  Good  Old  Japanese  Friends.  What  would  they  like? " Well,  what  can  we  do,  Patrick,  on  a  boat  that  we  can't  do on  an  airplane?  On  a  yacht,  we  can  put  windows  anywhere.  What  can  you  do  with  windows  on  an  airplane?"  Oh,  that's  a  good  question.  Because  if  you  want  to  move  things  around,  everything's  certified,  fuselage,  stress  loads,  decompression  issues.  Windows,  you  don't  touch.  But  the  Japanese  hypothetical  customer,  this  one  wanted  to  sit  closer  to  the  floor  on  a  shoji  screen,  sushi- like  table,  backlit,  like  they  would  in  their  home  or  like they could do in the  yacht.
 If  we  do  that  in  an  airplane,  now  we're  sitting  in  a  bathtub  because  I  can't  see  out  the  windows  if  I'm  sitting  on  the  floor.

 

00:10:52
Robert Ross: That's  right.

 

00:10:53
Jay Beever: We  sketched  in  the  windows  through  the  beltline,  so  to  speak,  or  the  waterline  of  the  top  of  the  ledge  of  the  interior,  anyway,  and  started  developing  images  of  it. And  it  turned  into  this  incredible  greenhouse  feel  in  the  middle  of  the  aircraft.  I'll  call  it,  really,  the  future  of  luxury.  Luxury  is,  in  my  opinion,  being  able  to  do  things  that  you  shouldn't  be  able  to  do.  In  an  airplane  at  35,000, 40, 45,000  and  even 51, 000  feet,  you  are  in  an  environment  that  wants  to  kill  you.  If  we  can  protect  from  that  and  still  experience  that  environment,  that's  luxury,  that's  the  secret  sauce.

 

 So,  we  took  this  design.  I  showed  it  to  my  then  boss,  CEO,  Marco  Tulio.  And  Marco  said, " Jay,  this  is  beautiful.  Someone's  going  to  want  to  buy  this."  I'm  like, " Yes."  He  goes, " We have  to  be  able  to  make  these  windows  because  these  are  the  size  of  emergency  exits  as  windows."  He  goes, " Well,  tell  you  what?  Go  to  Brazil,  work  with  the  engineers  and  find  out  if  there's  a  way  that  we  can  do  this  and  where  they  can  be  placed.  And just  see  if  there's  a  plan  that  we  can  say  is  authentic.  If  somebody  wants  it,  we  can  actually  make  it  for  them  because  we  want  to  be  able  to  make  people  want." " Great,  Marc.  I'll  do  that."

 

We  went  down  there.  And  lo  and  behold,  we  had  engineering  drawings  related  to  Coast  Guard  ERJ,  so  E145  search  and  rescue  coast  guard  airplanes.  And  in  those  airplanes,  you  need  an  observer  window.  And  it's  a  portrait- style  look  up  and  down  observer  window.  I'm  like, " Bingo,  that's  it. Can  I  put  that  on a  Lineage?" " Maybe.  Let  us  look  at  it."  They  had  our  drawings,  they  had  the  design  and  they  came  back  two  weeks  later,  email,  proof,  everything  that  I  needed  and  said, " We  can  do  it.  Just  stay  forward  of  the  wing  spar."  And  the  wing  spar  is  the  connected  muscle,  it's  called,  of  all  that  billet,  alloy,  aluminum,  and  titanium,  going  through  the  middle  of  the  airplane  connecting  the  two  wings  together.  So,  if  you  stay  forward  of  that  position,  the  fuselage  can  handle  the  loads  of  those  windows,  being  the  way  you  have  it  on  the  Kyoto  Airship.  And  that's  where  we  had  them  anyway,  it  was  forward  of  the  wing.  So,  we  were  safe.  We  published  it.  That  literally  was  the  most  viewed  online  digital  media  for  architectural  digest  one  year.

 

00:12:46
Robert Ross: It's  not  surprising.  It's  an  amazing  interior.  And  I'd  encourage  any  of  the  listeners  to  look  it  up  online.  It's  quite  something.  What did  you  call  that  particular  aircraft?

 

00:12:53
Jay Beever: We  call  it  the  Kyoto  Airship  because  Kyoto,  the  millennium  city,  the  thousand- year  city,  the  history  and  the  romance  and  everything  about  it.  Airships  have  the  blimped  connotation  and  all  of  that.  But  I  think  airships  also,  besides  some  of  the  negative  things  that  happened  in  the  past,  for  me,  was  luxury.  They're  romantic.  It  was  a  reason  to  dress  up  and  go  someplace.  And  it's  like  the  Pan  Am  Clippers,  top  hats  were  worn  when  you  got  in  and  dresses  and  it  meant  something  to  fly.  And  so,  those  two  things  together,  metaphorically,  so  to  speak,  was  why  we  went  with  the  Airship  route,  so  the  Kyoto  Airship.

 

 And  the  reason  I  told  that  story  was  to go back to  the Skyranch.  And  I  said, " Eddie,  not  that  your  airplane  isn't  wonderful  already  with  the  design  the  way  it  is,  but  we  need  a  big  window.  We  need  a  realm  of  intimidation."  As we talk about, I said, " Okay,  what  I'd  like  to  do  with  the  Lineage,  because  it's  a  custom  airplane,  let's  move  the  galley."  So,  the galley's  a  place  where you  get  all  your  food  and  the  refrigerator  and  the  cooking  ware  and  all  that  stuff.  In  a  normal  Lineage,  five  cabins  on  aircraft,  you  walk  into  the  interior,  you're  greeted  to  a  vestibule  area  with  the  sofa and  the  divan.  The  next  room  adjacent  to  that,  through  the  bulkhead,  is  the  galley. And  that's  where  the  flight  attendants  and  pilots  and  people  can  self- serve  there.  And  then  you  walk  into  the  dining  room.  And  then  after  the  dining  room  is  a  lavatory.  Then  after  the  lavatory  is  three  more  cabin  zones.
 I said, " I  want  to  flip  things  around  a  little bit,  because  if  this  is  J.  R.  Fracking's  business  jet,  done  the  most  beautiful  way,  let's  make  his  office  up  front.  So,  let's  move  the  galley  back  one  more  position.  Put  the  office  just  after  the  entry."  So,  nobody  gets  to  see  the  living  space  beyond  the  galley  in  the  back.  You  only  get  to  visit  upfront.  But  that's  pretty  cool  because  up  front  and  you've  got  this  giant  vertical  window  sitting  between  the  two  seats  that  you're  completely  distracted  by.  And  you're  focused  on  the  Grand  Canyon  flying  over  or  intimidated  by  this  window  that  you  feel  might  not  let  you  live.  And  J.  R.  Fracking  signs  the  deal.  And  you  didn't  even  realize it.

 

00:14:42
Robert Ross: What  a  great  narrative.  I  love  it.

 

00:14:44
Jay Beever: So  all of  that  went  into  that  concept. It  was  a  combination  of  top- down  technology  of  what  we  had  in  the  sandbox  of  engineering  within  the  company,  for  real  practical  purposes  of  saving  lives  over  the  ocean  or  some  other  area,  built  into  a  concept  that  was  an  aesthetic  theme  with  experiential  purpose  like  Eddie  does  so  well,  to  again,  gain  attention.  Come  look  at  that  Lineage.  Windows  are  the  future  of  luxury  in  aerospace. And  we  see  that  in  a  lot  of  concepts  now.  I  don't  want  to  say  we  started  it  because  there's  maybe  many  that  have  had  concepts  of  big  windows  in  the  past.  But  I  can  say that  we  definitely  contributed  to  this  revolution  of  the  future  of  luxury  in  aerospace,  is  being  able  to  immerse  yourself  in  an  environment  that  doesn't  want  you  there.  And  you're  able  to  enjoy  it.  We're  going  to  take  a  short  break,  Jay,  but  we'll  be  right  back.

 

00:15:29
Speaker 1: A  Moment  Of  Your  Time,  a  new  podcast  from  CurtCo  Media.

 

00:15:34
Speaker 4: Currently  21  years  old,  and  today  I'm going to read a poem for you.

 

00:15:36
Speaker 5: I felt  like  magic  extended  from  her  fingertips  down  to  the  base  of  my  spine.

 

00:15:40
Speaker 6: You  have  to  take care of yourself because the  world  needs  you  and  your  voice.

 

00:15:43
Speaker 7: Trust  me,  every  do  go  to  that  asked  about  me  was  ready  to  spit  on  my  dreams.

 

00:15:47
Speaker 8: But her fingers were facing me.

 

00:15:47
Speaker 9: You  feel  like  your  purpose  and  your  worth  is  really  being questioned.

 

00:15:50
Speaker 10: I'm going  to  stop  me  from  playing  the  piano.

 

00:15:52
Speaker 11: She  buys  walkie  talkies,  wonders  to  whom  she  should  give  the  second  device.

 

00:15:56
Speaker 12: Cats  don't  love  humans,  we  never  did,  we  never  will.  We  just  find ones that are more [inaudible

00:16:06].

 

00:15:59
Speaker 13: The beauty  of  rock  climbing  is that you can  only  focus  on  what's  right in front of you.

 

00:16:03
Speaker 14: And so,  our  American  life  begins.

 

00:16:07
Speaker 15: We  may  need  to  stay  apart,  but  let's  create  together.  Available  on  all  podcast  platforms.  Submit  your  piece  at  curtco. com/ amomentofyourtime.

 

00:16:21
Robert Ross: We're  back  with  Jay  Beever,  vice  president,  design  operations  with  Embraer  Executive  Jets.  Jay,  let  me  ask  you.  You  had  shared  something  called  the  Pulse  Concept.  It  blew  my  mind.  That's  all  I  can  say.  Why  don't  you  tell  us  about  it?

 

00:16:34
Jay Beever: I get  to  feel  like  Harley  Earl  and  the  Buick  Y- Job.

 

00:16:37
Robert Ross: That  was  the  first  show  car.

 

00:16:38
Jay Beever: Yeah.  And  look  at  the  design  for  '38. It looked  like  a  fifties  car,  that's  because  everybody  in  the  fifties  finally  figured  out  how  to  make  their  cars  look  like  Harley  Earl's  Buick.  If  you  look  at  the  thirties  automobiles,  you're  looking  at  Packards  and  Duesenbergs and  Studebakers,  and  these  cars  had  running  boards  and  continental  packages  on  the  side  with  spare  tires  and  wire  wheels  showing  through  the  clampdown  design. And then  you  have  the  Buick  Y- Job,  it  was  decades  ahead  of  its  time.  And  it  changed  the  perception  of  what  an  automobile  should  look  like.

 

 So,  in  aerospace,  we  make  incredible  machines,  jets.  We  make  jets.  And  they  serve  a  purpose.  But  maybe  the  aerospace  industry  should  change.  Maybe  we  can  be  20, 30, 50  years  ahead  of  our  time  and  dream  up  the  experience  that  Embraer  would  like  its  customers  to  have  in  the  future.  Assuming  a  50- year  roadmap  of  top- down  technology  based  off  of  this  Bandeirante of  2019.  And  I  say  Bandeirante  because that  was  the  name  of  the  aircraft,  the  turboprop  airplane,  the  first  airplane  from  Embraer  in  1969.  We  celebrate  that  quite  a  bit.  And  this  is  our  50th- year  anniversary  in  2019.

 

 The  thought  was,  why  don't  we  celebrate  our  50- year  anniversary  by  celebrating  our  future  50  years?  We  need  to  look  back.  We  need  to  learn  about  the  stories  and  the  sacrifices  that  we  get  to  ride  on  the  shoulders  of  today.  I'm  at  Embraer  because  they  did  so  good  in  the  past.  And  I  appreciate  that.  And  what  if  2019s  vertical  takeoff  and  landing  eVTOL that  we  see  so  much  about  today  for  air  taxi  transport  and  the  dreams  of  city  commutes  in  the  sky,  over  the  freeways  and  congestion,  what  if  we  took  that  technology  and  said,  we're  going  to  build  off  of  that  for  the  next  50  years  like  we  did  50  years  ago,  what  could  we  have? And  that's  what  led  us  to  the  Pulse,  the  Embraer  Pulse.

 

 Little  did  I  realize  that  that  concept  has  actually  gained  even  more  traction  because  COVID- 19  kicked  in  and  now  everybody's  concerned  about  their  own  personal  spaces.  And  the  shared  economy,  renting  space,  whether  it's  renting  a  home,  Airbnb,  Vrbo,  Uber,  renting  a  car  or  renting  space  in  a  car  by  having  someone  drive  you  but  two  minutes  ago,  you  don't  know  who  was  just  in  that  car  so  how  do  you  know  it's  clean?  So,  these  industries  have  been  turned  upside  down.  And  that  was  all  about  the  shared  economy,  easy  access  to  these  machines  that  we  cannot  have  a  whole  ownership  of.

 

 And  the  future  is  going  to  be  commoditized.  No  one  will  own  their  own  airplane.  It's  always  going  to  be  chartered  or  rented  because  everybody  deserves  to  be  in  one. And  that's  kind  of  where  the  industry  was  moving.  And  I  never  really  liked  that,  to  be  honest,  because  I  thought  that's  not  special.  If  your  space  is  also going to  be  somebody  else's  space...  Guess  what?  I'm  not  going  to  put  the  best  materials  inside  of  that  space.

 

00:19:10
Robert Ross: That's  why  some  people  bring  their  own  sheets  and  pillows  to  the  hotel,  no  matter  how  nice  it  is.

 

00:19:14
Jay Beever: Absolutely.  There's  a  level  of  insecurity  about  that  that's  not  comfortable,  that's  not  luxurious.  So,  what  if  the  future  of  transportation  truly  is  A  to  B  anywhere  like  Napa  Valley  to  San  Onofre  Beach?  There's  no  airport  in  San  Onofre,  yet  we're  going  to  fly  and  drive.  But  we're  going  to  do  it,  because  50  years  from  now,  we're  going  to  own  personal  spaces  like  a  pod.  We  have  our  personal  space. And  the  thing  that  is  shared  or  rented  would  be  the  wings  or  the  wheels.  So  what  if  I  could  take  my  clean  space,  my  personal  space,  my  protected  space,  my  cherished  space  and  move  it  to  the  beach,  move  it  to  the  Monaco  F1  races?  Instead  of  being  a  yacht  backed  up  to  the  race,  I'm  actually  on  a  land  yacht  because  when  I  landed,  my  living  space  was  transported  onto  an  automotive  coach.  And  the  coach  drove  me  up  to  the  side  of  the  race.
 Oh,  that's  A  to  B.  That's  what  you're  talking  about.  So,  seamless  travel  through  different  means,  but  you  never  left  the  comfort  of  your  environment.  What  if  that's  our  future?  And  if  we  build  that  dream,  will  others  want  to  be  a  part  of  it?  Will  others  build  concepts  similar  to  it?  Will  other  Buick  Y- Jobs  be  created?  Absolutely.  But  that's  a  revolution.  That's  building  a  vision  that  others  think  is  worthy  of  saying  they  want  to  do  it  too.  And  that's  what  the  Pulse  was  all  about.  Can  we  get  away  with  autonomous  flight?  No  need  for  a  cockpit?  Because  that's  50  years  from  now.  We're  doing  autonomous  flight  as  we  speak  today,  so  it's  truly  feasible.  Do  I  know  how  the  pod  disconnects  from  the  airplane  into  the  coach?  Nope.  Not  at  all.  That's  for  30  years  from  now  when  we start  developing.

 

00:20:47
Robert Ross: But  it's  good  to  know.  Aerospace  engineers  going to get  to  space  stations  to  dock  with  each  other,  so  I  imagine  it's  possible.

 

00:20:53
Jay Beever: It's  absolutely  possible.  And  the  fun  thing  was, we got  to  design  something  with  wheels  again.  So,  I  got  to  throw  back  my  passions  for  car  design  and  we  designed  out  this  coach.  And  the  coach  was  really  another  piece  of  dream  and  that's  who  should  build  the  first  flying  car,  a  car  company,  or  an  airplane  company?  What do  you  think,  Robert?

 

00:21:09
Robert Ross: Other  than  maybe  the  little  Honda  jet,  I  think  I'd  probably  prefer  that  an  aircraft  manufacturer  produce  that  flying  car  for  me.

 

00:21:16
Jay Beever: That's  exactly  what  somebody  else  said  that  show  the  appreciation  for  the  severe  engineering  requirements  are  to  be  in  the  air.

 

00:21:23
Robert Ross: I  used  to  have  an  aircraft  client,  an  OEM.  And  the  president  of  the  company  took  me  aside  once  after  a  couple  of  cocktails  and  he  said, " You  know  what  our  clients  care  about?  They  want  an  aircraft  that  won't  kill  them."

 

00:21:35
Jay Beever: That's  right.  Safety,  number  one.

 

00:21:36
Robert Ross: It's  all  about  safety.

 

00:21:37
Jay Beever: We  want  it  over- engineered.  And  redundancy  is  King.  You  won't  hear  an  aerospace  engineer  or  manufacturer  not  talk  about  redundancy,  ten  to  the  minus  seventh  and  five  ways  to  do  one  thing  because  if  two  fail,  I've  got  three  more  to  back  up  on.  And  that's  why  we  have  such  a  great  record  worldwide  of  air  travel  over  the  decades.  Anecdotally,  I  had  a  really  neat  experience  where  I  was  able  to  ask  that  question  in  the  confines  of  our  design  studio  here  in  Melbourne,  Florida,  on  the  Space  Coast.  A  gentleman  named  Edsel  Ford  II  came  in  because  he  owns  Pentastar  Air,  up  in  Michigan.  And  Pentastar  Air  used  to  be  the  flight  department  for  Chrysler.  Ford  family  member,  board  member,  bought  Chrysler's  flight  department,  turned  it  into  Pentastar  Air  and  they  service  and  cater  to  private  jets  by  the  hundreds.

 

 Well,  he  was  down  here  in  Florida.  And  here  I  was,  ex- Ford  guy  for  15  years.  Never  had  the  chance  to  meet  Mr.  Ford.  And  here  he  is  coming  into  Embraer's  facility  to  take  a  tour.  Oh  my  goodness.  I  had  a  chance  to  spend  four  hours  with  him.  We  had  lunch.  We  came  into  the  design  studio.  We  talked  about  car  design  and  the  Mustang  in the 60, 64,  65,  when  he  was  young-

 

00:22:42
Robert Ross: Isn't  that great.

 

00:22:42
Jay Beever: And  all  kinds  of  neat  stuff.  I  mentioned  some  of  the  concept  cars  and  the  GR- 1  and  Ford  Bronco  of  '05  and  the  Ford  Mustang.  And  it  was  a  dream  come  true  because  I  still  have  such  fond  memories  of  Florida.  And  here  I  am,  a  Ford  family  member,  connected  to  the  aerospace  industry.  And  now,  I'm  in  the  aerospace  industry  with  Embraer,  speaking  about  things  I  never  would  have  ever  thought.  And  I  asked  him  that  question,  being  he's  a  car  guy,  obviously,  and  aerospace  man, " Who  should  build  the  flying  car?"  And  he  said, " An  airplane  company."

 

 But  now  we  have  a  car  company  like  Tesla  by  Elon,  with  SpaceX,  landing  rockets.  Landing  rockets!

 

00:23:15
Robert Ross: They're  near  you  too.  Are  they  out  there?

 

00:23:17
Jay Beever: Yep,  they're  right  here.  They're  our  neighbors.  And  it's  an  exciting  time  to  be  here  in  the  spaceport  planet  earth  called  the  Kennedy  Space  Center.  And  that's  the  thing,  those  are  perceptions  also,  but  reality  of  aerospace  and  what  its  needs  are.  But  automotive  is  catching  up, in  the  sense  that  anything's  possible.  That's  what  the  Pulse  was going  to  be  about,  anything  is  possible.  Why  can't  we  make  a  car?  There's  nothing  saying  that  Embraer,  20  years,  10  years  from  now,  doesn't  decide  to  make  autonomous  cars.  We have  the  facilities.  We  have  the  infrastructure.  Why  not?  It  begs  those  questions.  Yeah.

 

00:23:44
Robert Ross: It's  an  engaging  concept that  I  would  encourage  any  of  our  listeners  to  watch  the  animated  video.  How  would  they  find  that,  Jay?

 

00:23:52
Jay Beever: It's  on  YouTube.  You  can  type  in  Embraer  Pulse.  Embraer  is  spelled  E- M- B  as  in  boy,  R- A- E- R,  Embraer,  which  is  a  Portuguese  acronym  for  the  Enterprise  of  Brazilian  Aerospace.  And  you'll  find  it  pretty  quickly.

 

00:24:05
Robert Ross: That's  the  future.  Talking  about  the  past,  we're  on  a  Zoom  call  right  now,  and  I'm  looking  behind  you,  Jay  and  I  see  a  row  of  model  cars  that  are  all  very  alluring.  I  think  I  see  a  '63  Vette  and  maybe  a  lowered  Ford  Fairlane,  the  Porsche,  there's  a  first  series  Corvette.  I  see  a  bunch  of  stuff,  but  it's  hard  to  make  out  what  they  are.  You're  obviously  a  car  guy  through  and  through. And since this  show  is  about  cars  that  matter,  let's  kind  of  take  a  drive  down  that  lane  for  a  moment.  What  kind  of  cars  really  get  you  going?

 

00:24:32
Jay Beever: Muscle  cars,  of  course.  '68  Camaro,  for  me,  was  the car I always wanted. I did  end  up  having  one  one  time and it  was  such  a  joy.  That  Studebaker's...  But  you  know  what's  interesting  is  my  two  favorite  cars  as  a  child  was  a  '57  Chevy  and  the  second  was  a  Greyhound  Scenicruiser.

 

00:24:48
Robert Ross: Oh  yeah.

 

00:24:49
Jay Beever: Good  old  Raymond  Loewy,  Scenicruiser  Greyhound.  No  idea  who  Raymond  was  then  as  a  kid.  But  it  had  twin  axles  in  the  back,  dual  tires.  And  you  can  see  all  that  detail.  And  this  little  metal  vista  cruiser- looking  bus  called the  Greyhound.  And  I  think  it  was  those  proportions  and  shapes...  It's  like  a  backward  747.  It's  a  bubble  top.

 

00:25:09
Robert Ross: Back then,  there  was  something  about  that  streamline  design  era,  where  a  toaster  could  be  as  exciting  as  a  race  car  in  the  way  it  looked.  And  there  was  all  of  a  sudden  this  confluence  of  design  aesthetics  that  just  touched  everything  in  our  lives,  from  appliances  to  freight  trains,  to  ships,  to  imaginary  flying  saucers.

 

00:25:28
Jay Beever: And  Raymond  started  it  all.  He's  a  godfather  of  streamlined  design  and  all  these  things  that  you  just  mentioned  that  we  appreciate  to  this  day.  He  was  truly  the  crossover  guy.  He  did  all.  Graphic  d...  Shell  oil  company's  logo,  Coca- Cola,  Apollo  rocket  interiors,  furniture.

 

00:25:44
Robert Ross: Right.

 

00:25:44
Jay Beever: This is a guy who spent  18  years,  again,  designing  Studebakers,  and  now  the  Greyhound  bus  and  the  streamlined  locomotives  and  the  fans  and  irons  and  consumer  products,  everything  you  talked  about.  Crossover  design,  he  proved  it.  Little  did  I  realize  that  favorite  little  bus  toy  of  mine  was  designed  by  the  very  guy  that  I  look  back  on,  and  probably  many  and  most  do,  of  wanting  to  emulate  that  experience  or  repeat  it  in  some  way  and  have  the  joy  of  crossing  into  something  new  to  keep  yourself  fresh.  We're  meant  to  live  forever  creating  new  ideas  and  experiencing  new  things.  The  capacity  of  the  human  brain  is  unending.  Why  be  stuck  in  one  venue?  And  that's  really  what  he  did.  I'm  looking  at  the  website  right  now.  I  just  typed  in  Raymond  Loewy  designs  and  everything  he  worked  on. You know  what's  interesting  is  I'll  go  to  my  third  favorite  vehicle,  which  is  kind  of  weird  and  obscure,  but  an  old  Vista  Cruiser  station  wagon  with  the  see- through  roof  out  front.  Isn't  that  not  a  mini  Scenicruiser  bus?

 

00:26:39
Robert Ross: It  sure  is.  Yeah,  that  was  a  great  design.  Those  were  rare  and  I  can't  remember  the  years.  That  was  '68  through  '73  or  something  like  that?

 

00:26:48
Jay Beever: Yep.  I'll  take  the  442  version  with  rally  wheels.  No  woody.  I  don't  want  the  woody  look.  But  I'm  going  to  back  that  thing  up  to  Doheny  State  Beach  there  in  Dana  point,  California,  with  a  couple  of  bundles  of  wood  and  light  a  beach  bonfire  and  feel  like  a  beach  boy.  And  I  think  what  I  realize  is  at  a  young  age,  it  was  those  experiences  that  were  really  intriguing  more  than  just  a  car  design,  but  what  I  can  do  with  it.  That  bus  did  something.  It  treated  people  to  a  view  like  these  big  windows  in  our  airplanes,  to  an  environment  that  you  shouldn't  be  really  seeing  in  that  perspective,  like  the  bubble  top  trains  in  Europe.

 

00:27:19
Robert Ross: hat's  right.  You're  not  supposed  to  be  that  high  up.

 

00:27:21
Jay Beever: And  being  a  kid  in  the  backseat  of  a  Vista  Cruiser,  looking  out  through  the  windshield  at  the  stars...  Well,  your  windshield,  which  was  aimed  toward  the  roof,  it's  amazing.  It  creates  experiences.  It's  not  just  a  commodity  of  A  to  B.  And  you  discover  that  when  you  cross  over  into  different  industries.  And  that's  why,  with  our  design  operations  team  here  at  Embraer,  one  of the  engineers  recently  commented  to  one  of  my  managers, " It  doesn't  make  sense  and  we're  just  continually  amazed  that  Embraer  has  given  such  freedom.  And  that  we  see  so  much  freedom  of  doing  things  different  out  of  the  design  team.  And  it's  accepted."
 And  so,  for  the  engineers  who  spent  decades  doing  exactly  as  they're  told  in  a  fantastic  way,  because  of  the  products  that  we  have  today,  are  now  seeing  a  cultural  change  because  the  design  acceptance  is  there.  And  they're  seeing  the  fruits  and  the  benefits  of  doing  things  differently  and  the  appreciation  from  customers.  Now  they're  getting  excited.  So,  we're  going  to  have  thousands  of  engineers  here,  really  excited  to  do  things  out  of  the  box.  So,  everybody  needs  to  keep  their  eyes  out  on  this  company,  I  will  tell  you  that.

 

00:28:16
Robert Ross: We're  going  to  take  a  quick  break.  We'll  be  right  back.

 

00:28:21
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00:28:53
Robert Ross: We're  back  with  Jay  Beever.

 

00:28:54
Jay Beever: Can  we  talk about  that  office  chair  real  quick?

 

00:28:57
Robert Ross: Yes,  absolutely.  I  would  love  to  segue  into  that  because  you  showed  me  some  pictures  of  a  chair  that  looked  remarkable  and  unlike  any  of  the  typical  chairs  that  we've  been  sitting  in  for  the  last  20, 30, 40, 50  years.

 

00:29:08
Jay Beever: Well,  the  Pulse  Concept  did  something  else,  like  that  Buick  Y- Job,  we  used  it  to  tease  actual  developments  that  we're  working  on.  So,  when  you  see  a  concept  car,  it's  not  only  a  fresh  look  and in  a  public  pulse  survey,  let's  say  of,  acceptance  or  polarizing  opinions,  but  often  car  companies  will  also  filter  in  product  development  that's  not  known  about  yet  into  the  vehicle,  innovations  that  are  truly  part  of  a  roadmap,  but  they  won't  say  it.  And  later  when  it  comes  out,  it  adds  to  the  essence  of  it  truly  being  inspired  from  the  show  car,  but  in  reality,  the  show  car  was  inspired  by  these  hidden  behind  the  scenes,  Jurassic  Park,  egg  cracking  scientists,  putting  innovation  together  that  we  want  to  tease  to  the  market  so  that  when  we  do  reveal  the  actual  vehicle,  they  see  the  promise,  they  see  the  commitment  that  they're  actually  going  to  make  this.
 I  won't  say  which,  but  there  are  some  things  in  the  Pulse  aircraft  interior  and  functionality  that  are  teasers  to  what  we'll  do  in  the  future.  We  have  some  patents  on  it.  We've  got  some  projects  in  process.  So,  in  that  spirit,  what  about  furniture.  I  said  earlier,  aircraft  interiors  are  very  much  environmental  design. We're designing  an  environment  to  live  in,  to  serve  you.  This  butler  with  wings,  coming  and  going  when  you  need  him,  but  when  you  don't,  he's  not  there  because  you don't  want to  be  distracted  by  technology  and  different  buttons  and  switches  because  it  should  know  when  I'm  looking  at it,  it  should  know  when  I'm  reaching  for  and  things  like  that.

 

 So,  the  chair,  the  seat  inside  that,  looks  incredible.  Chase,  our  designer,  who's  designing  out  the  interior.  I  said, " Chase,  I  think  we're  going  to  need  to  make  an  office  chair  out  of  that."  And  he  said, " What are  you  talking  about?"  He  was  pretty  fresh  within  the  company  and  coming  out  of  art  center  in  California  and  didn't  understand  completely  how  crazy  we  could  be  here.  And  lo  and  behold,  I  was  able  to  work  with  Chase  and  make  that  chair  from  the  Pulse  into  an  office  chair.  Because  it  was  not  only  a  teaser  for  aerospace  interiors,  but  can  we  flip  the  paradigm?  Which  is  why  we  called  it  the  Paradigma.  And  Paradigma  is  paradigm  with  an  A  on  the  end.  And  that's  phonetically  pronounced.  It's  a  Portuguese  word  for  paradigm,  paradigma.

 

00:31:03
Robert Ross: Oh, okay. Okay.

 

00:31:03
Jay Beever: The Paradigma  office  chair  is  switching  a  paradigm.  The  paradigm  is,  rather  than  aircraft  interiors  be  inspired  by  furniture  and  great  furniture  designs,  why  not  the  aircraft of  the  future  inspire  the  office  chair  you  can  have  today?  Let's  take  from  50  years,  this  seat  from  a  Pulse  concept,  that's  going  to  change  aerospace and  the  way  we  view  mobility  and  I  can  have  that  in  my  office.  Oh,  and  by  the  way, it's going  to  function  like  a  seat  found  inside  of  a  private  jet.  And  those  who  have  private  jets  and  have  flown  in  them,  not  like  commercial,  know  that  you  reach  down  or  you  reach  forward  and  pull  a  lever  and  you  can  slide  your  seat  around.  You  can  move  backwards,  rotate,  go  left  and  right,  forward,  recline,  leg  rest.  It's  the  ultimate  chair.  Well,  this  office  chair  is  not going  to  be  sitting  on  a  post  because  the  seat  inside  the  Pulse  concept  is  side  mounted.  It's  floating  over  the  floor.  So,  this  needs  to  be  articulated  or  hanging  over  the  base,  not  sitting  straight  off  the  base.  Oh,  we've  got  leverage  issues.

 

 How  can  we  balance  that?  And  how  can  we  get  friction  and  leverage  not  to  destroy  the  bearings  and  the  movement?  It  can't  be  done.  Yeah,  I  can.  And  we  went  and  built  a  prototype.  And  even  just  this  last  week,  we've  shown  potential  partners  the  prototype.  It  functions,  it  holds  our  weight,  it  slides,  retracts  and  swivels.  It  rotates  around  just  like  you're  rotating  around  inside  of  a  private  jet.  You're  not  sitting  on  a  pedestal  with  five  arms  and  a  bunch  of  casters  on  the  bottom  like  some  of  these  other  seats  that  some  will  pay $10, 000  for,  but  all  they  do  is  take  a  seat  out  of  a  vehicle  and  slap  it  on  top  of  a  pole  and  put  it  behind  a  desk.  No,  no,  no,  no.  This  is  furniture  design.  It's  bent  plywood,  look  like  an  Eames  chair  from  the fifties,  but  it's  not.  It's  from  an  airplane  and  the  surfaces  are  floating.

 

 It  has  the  Ipanema  sew  style  from  our  Bossa  Nova  treatment  of  our  Phenoms  and  Praetors.  It  reeks  of  the  soul  of  executive  jet  detailing  the  Bossa  Nova  story.  And  it  comes  from  an  aircraft of  the  future  and  it  moves  like  it's  inside  of  a  private  jet.  And  that's  where  I  suddenly  start  feeling  like  when  Raymond  Loewy  was  able  to  go  and  design  things  in  different  industries,  as  a  car  guy,  designed  the  office  of  the  future.  As  an  airplane  guy,  I'm  going  to design the  office  chair  of  the  future.  We're  talking  to  yacht  companies  and  help  design  their  interiors.  Because  design  operations  now  for  Embraer,  because  of  our  success,  I've  been  able  to  convince  the  company  to  allow  us  to  be  revenue  generating  so  I  can  take  on  clients  and  we  can  do  stuff  for  other  industries.  Maybe  there's  a  boat  company  that  wants  aircraft- like  craftsmanship- execution  style  on  a  yacht  or  on  a  speed  boat.  That's  where  we're  going.

 

00:33:29
Robert Ross: It  sounds  like  you've  got  a lot  of  latitude  at  the  company  to  really  explore  new  ideas  that  are  somewhat  out of  the  orbit  of  just  aviation.  And  that  obviously  suggests  a  CEO  or  a  management  group  that  really  does  have  a  vision.

 

00:33:42
Jay Beever: Robert,  that's  true.  And  I've  said  a  lot  about  Brazil  and  its  passions  for  design,  but  my  current  boss,  Michael  Amalfitano,  CEO  of  Embraer  Executive  Jets,  has  really  been  a  cheerleader  and  a  supporter  of  this.  He's  a  businessman.  He's  been  involved  in  aerospace  finance  and  aircraft  finance  and  business  for  decades.  And  he  sees  the  value  that  design  can  provide.  And  he's  shamelessly  encouraging  me  to  do  stuff  that  I've  never  imagined  having...  I  mean,  I  have  a  boss  who  literally  gets  it  when  I  go  to  explain  something.  And  that  whole  earlier  story  about  design  needs  to  be  sold,  I'm  getting  lazy,  I  don't  have  to  sell  anymore.

 

00:34:18
Robert Ross: Isn't  that  a  luxury?  Boy,  maybe  that's  the  ultimate  luxury,  is  for  a  designer  not  to  have  to  sell  his  own  design.

 

00:34:24
Jay Beever: Freedom  to  explore.  You're  right,  that  is  the  luxury.

 

00:34:28
Robert Ross: Jay  Beever  and  I  had  so  much  more  to  discuss.  So,  we're  going  to  continue  our  deep  dive  into  Jay's  background  and  his  thoughts  on  the  future  of  luxury  next  time  on  Cars  That  Matter  where  we  continue  to  talk  about  the  passions  that  drive  us  and  the  passions  we  drive.
 This  episode  of  Cars  That  Matter  was  hosted  by  Robert  Ross,  produced  by  Chris  Porter,  edited  by  Chris  Porter,  sound  engineering  by  Michael  Kennedy,  theme  song  by  Celeste  and  Eric  Dick,  additional  music  and  sound  by  Chris  Porter.  Please  like,  subscribe  and  share  this  podcast.  I'm  Robert  Ross  and  thanks  for  listening.

 

00:35:17
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